So, question, Samgirls....

[roxy]

Did the Samgirls not like the Amelia storyline when it first popped up? I mean, in the beginning, *before* they made it stupid. I thought it was very interesting and liked it a lot at first--one, because it was an interesting bit of tension between the boys and two, because it seemed to show that Sam still had a chance to have what he always wanted but I think came to believe was impossible--a life out of hunting. Plus it was like every 'boys settled out of the life' fanfic ever written just, y'know, without Dean. It seemed to me that they started off great but screwed it up, and in their floundering with this impossible storyline they never let Sam explain just *why* he never looked for Dean besides a limp, "we swore we wouldn't do that again". Still, I was willing to work with that, perfectly willing to go there with Sam. It even that made sense, I thought. I believe Sam's smart enough to say, "okay, all that other stuff never worked, in fact, kind of backfired on both of us so this time around, I'm going to get on with my life." And when we catch up with him again he's still a mess, but not as horrendous a mess as he'd been the other times Dean was *gone*. I could see why Amelia would appeal to him with her slightly Dean-like qualities. Nothing attracts Sam as much as a girl like his brother.

And then, just as it was getting really good, with proper amounts of angst and lovely moments between Amelia and Sam if you looked past the godawful soap-opera fuzz those scenes were presented with, they drop a Stupid Bomb, full of 'not really dead husband'. That was insulting. That was something we don't expect from our Show. I applaud Jared for making any of that work as well as it did.

It still bothers me. I feel like I got short-changed and Sam got short-changed. And if I felt that way as a Deangirl, I wonder, how much did it bother Samgirls?

Comments

[tasabian.livejournal.com]

I'm more of a general viewer & was disappointed because I've really liked Liane Babalan in other things and this was such a "nothing" plot...if they'd paralleled her anxiety for her husband with Sam desperately searching for Dean, that might have made their relationship more compelling.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

I agree! I think part of the problem with that storyline was we only know what we know of her through Sam's eyes so that whole husband thing really didn't work. It would have been more interesting to see them in a partnership more like Sam has with Dean...writers, remember that next time you try to write domestic fic! :)

[(Anonymous)]

Honestly, part of me's still kind of waiting to find out that the whole "not dead husband" was Our Kind of Thing. I mean, how many times has someone coming back from the dead on Supernatural ever actually been a case of "Oops, he wasn't really dead after all!"? It's always demons or angels or something monstery!

--Jessica

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

I thought that husband coming to life thing was a crappy red herring, thrown stinking on our doorstep. I think we were *supposed* to think her husband might be a demon but I'll bet the collective force of Fandom's outrage causing a shift in Time and Space made them drop the whole idea. At least, that's my theory. ;)

♥ !

[firesign10.livejournal.com]

As a Samgirl, I hated it from the get-go. I didn't like a single thing about her, starting from the moment he brought her the dog and she forced him to take the dog with him. All I thought was what a bitch she was. Then she was an alcoholic bitch, and belittling him at every turn. To me, he looke confused all the time, and I could not understand - totally aside from the dean-searching issue - why he was attracted to her, why he wanted to bone her, and what it was about her that drew him. If it was just the non-hunting like, then she could have been anybody and so she was meaningless. I could only think he wanted to be punished for losing Dean like that. I think I could have been okay with a Sam's out of the life storyline, but she was just repugnant :-P The undead husband was just the icing on the cake of crapitude.

Solely my opinion, all respect to you, Roxy, YMMV

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Really? But he was already living with an alcoholic bitch who belittled him before that. *G*

I think he was just really damaged by what happened and while I agree he did look lost in the deep end sometimes, I really wanted to see Sam do some deep-soul searching over Dean vs Amelia but that never really happened. Plus what a misstep with her bullying him to take the dog. It did kind of set her up as an *unlikable* bitch, instead of an amusing one. In the end, sadly, I think she was meaningless. Dean giving Benny the boot was more affecting than Sam not choosing Amelia.

I will never forgive them for "Don's not dead!" NEVER!!

Your opinion is just what I want, my dear. :)

[firesign10.livejournal.com]

But he was already living with an alcoholic bitch who belittled him before that

One with a dick ;-)

Plus what a misstep with her bullying him to take the dog. It did kind of set her up as an *unlikable* bitch, instead of an amusing one.

THIS. I think before then I had been "okay, let's see who she is" but after that, I was WTF??? Horribly done, and I just could not come back from that. Then it was his clothes, and he was a drifting loser, yadda yadda yadda. She was ready enough to sleep with him though. (Like, who wouldn't??? But I digress.)

*mwah!!* Feel free to send me BB as you wish.

[tabaqui]

Ah ha ha. Totally, 100 percent this.

[firesign10.livejournal.com]

*high fives!!*

[bt-kady.livejournal.com]

When we heard in the spoilers pre-season about Sam's girlfriend, I was ok with the idea. I've never disliked the idea of the guys having relationships (unlike other fans.) But, once we began seeing the episodes, and saw how the whole Sam/Amelia thing was written, I wasn't as thrilled. I agree with Jared that the whole storyline was weak. I don't blame Sam for not looking for Dean - I was actually rather pissed at Dean for the attitude he copped - but I've come to understand his side of things, even though I will almost always side with my Sammy. (I don't call myself a Samazon for nothing!)

I hope the writers let the Amelia story die a natural death. If Sam is to ever have a relationship with a woman, one that is allowed to last, I hope it's with Sarah Blake. She was my favorite of all his ladies. (I liked Dean with Jamie, from Monster Movie.)

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Oh, there's no doubt that Dean was going to be pissed--he always imagines Sam is going to think the same way he does. I don't think he'll ever get that he and Sam really don't think alike, but I put that down to the sibling thing, especially Dean being oldest. I think the oldest sib never gets over that loss of power, lol! I admit, I was a little surprised at Sam's reaction to Benny, it was odd that he never gave him the benefit of the doubt since he's had a history of doing just that.

The story line was weak, with a rather boring payoff and that pissed me off because I'd been so on-board for the whole thing. I guess in a way, if Sarah Blake (who I liked but not as much as Madison) does come into play, we can think of Amelia as clearing the way for Sam to think about having a serious relationship again, something he'd given up on after Jess, I think.

Also, I kind of don't get why folks are into Jamie? She didn't ping any especial bells with me and I just thought of her as a sideplot in Monster Movie. I'm much more into the idea of Cassie but I'll admit, for no other reason than that she was a character of color, they had history even if it kind of stunk and they looked really pretty together. My ideal girl for Dean? Tamara, from The Magnificent Seven, just because she's one of the coolest chicks they've ever had on SpN!! :D

[bt-kady.livejournal.com]

I have more than one favorite girl for Dean. The previously mentioned Jamie (I liked her spunk) Carmen (too bad she was only in Dean's mind) and yes, even Lisa. I didn't like Cassie (can't really tell you why) and I wasn't fond of Tamara either. I think both women were too bitchy to suit me. My favorite? If I have to choose, it'd be either Jamie or Carmen. (My writing partner and I write a curtain!fic verse where both brothers have married and started families. We gave Jamie to Dean. We created an OC for Sam, but I wish, looking back, we'd given him Sarah Blake. She was perfect for him.)

[peepingdru.livejournal.com]

SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO totally agree....I never really accepted the Amelia story line...but thought OK post traumatic....we all do THANGS....but it did insult the relationship b/n the bros by NOT looking at Sam's decision deeply....it was all sooooooo wishy washy.
I just hope they don't bring it all back....:/

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Right? They need to explain, but for god's sake, let's not fall back into that relationship!

[portraitofafool.livejournal.com]

I didn't like it from the beginning because (1) Amelia was a cunt and (2) Sam didn't make any sense to me. I thought maybe she was worth giving a chance at first, but I changed my mind about that pretty quickly. I try to go into things with an open mind, but Amelia just... *spits* I missed most of the first episodes of the season, but I did glean enough to really be o_O about it all, especially that. I was all on board for Sam to have a storyline that didn't revolve around him getting up to the dickens (with all the best intentions, as usual) but instead there... was... that. The 10 year old shithead kid in me was stomping my foot going, "That's not fair!" about it, too. I mean, Dean got his shot with Lisa (whom I despise and always have... ohhhh my thoughts on that...). Then Sam gets his "shot"--I use "" because it wasn't real at all, it was forced and complete bullshit--and ultimately all that "shot" did was make Sam out to be a disloyal asshole who doesn't care about his brother. WHAT?!

I am really sick of Sam being villainized, whether it be extreme (Lucifer) or relatively passive (Amelia), he's still always made out to look like a really selfish, completely self-centered/absorbed asshole in such situations. Yet, he's not and up until The Amelia Debacle, every "bad" thing he ever did--and was never allowed to live down or move past--was done with good reasons, many of which involved his love/loyalty for/to Dean. All this Amelia crap only leads to more Sam-bashing--of which this fandom has too much as it is--and more skewing of his character in a really negative way. I don't believe for one damned minute that he just let it go and said, "Welp, I hit this dog and now I need to fuck the vet that patched him up. Maybe we can hold each other and cry about how fucked up our lives are later." ... "What? Oh, Dean... Dean... Who's that?" Nuh-uh. Even if the show hand-waves as they have an unfortunately bad history of doing, I will never buy that line the way they presented it. Especially given that Sam was bailing out from um... Dick Roman's HQ... when he hit the dog... The fact he even stopped in such a situation does not gel. So, then he decides to play Good Samaritan in the midst of a hell of a crisis (again: it does not gel), meets Amelia and okay, well, that's that then. NO. I think (HOPE) Meg was hinting at something when she said that to Sam about, "You hit a dog [...]" My point being, I didn't like the Amelia line; it makes Sam look like a rat bastard and made Dean into a whiny douche bag (he was really pissing me off there for a bit). Dean's total about-face with Benny--and maybe it's just me, but he's always pretty happy to find himself a "replacement brother" when he's pissed at Sam (he did it with Cas, too), which is petty and not cool at all. In fact it's a bastardish thing to do and may have had something to do with Sam's dislike for Benny more than the fact Benny was a vampire. That whole angle was also a bit strange since Dean's Mr. Black-and-White and Sam's Mr. Grey, but it was at least explained to a satisfactory degree; unlike Sam/Amelia. Also, after what Dean did to Amy (that was fucking unforgiveable in my book) that may have also had something to do with Sam being all, "Um. Hold the damn phone a minute, dickhead." in regards to Benny. Of course no one ever says in the show and so we, the fans, are left to speculate and it all serves to just make Sam look like a terrible individual because most people don't give Sam an inch even though they will give Dean miles. Hell people on the show do it; you ever notice how when Sam and Dean save the day, Dean is usually the only one of them anyone (especially the sad, desperate and pathetic women) thank? It's all so skewed to me. :(

[portraitofafool.livejournal.com]

Frankly, I have never liked any of the "Sam and Dean have a love interest" storylines. Not because I am opposed to them having someone other than each other; I think it would be great, but the reason I don't like them is because the stories are so weak. Lisa was just disgusting, I'm sorry, but she was. All I ever wanted to do was slap that woman. Simpering bitch much? God. Cassie, I would've liked except the actress was so bad at acting it was painful to watch her and they had no real chemistry together. Just. NONE. And then the random skanks Dean picks up are about as wooden as toothpicks and again: no chemistry. There really wasn't even any chemistry with him and Lisa, at least not of the "yeah, I buy this is romance right here" variety; although I could see them being friends. Then Sam's not had much to work with over the years, although I hear good things about Madison. I will never watch that episode though because just knowing how they handled the werewolf thing irritates the ever-loving shit outta me. I also have to say I kind of liked Sam and Katie Cassidy's Ruby; their chemistry was awesome to me. I know he was seeing Gen, who (duh) was Ruby 2.0 and they were hot on-screen in a porno way, but I wasn't all gung-ho for an actual "relationship" with the characters as I was Sam/Ruby 1.0; that could've been awesome. Frankly, the best relationships (or pseudo-relationships since nothing much ever came of them) on the show to me have been Bobby/Sheriff Mills and Castiel/Meg (so much love for that and I am still so sad about Meg dying).

Note: If this post is in reference to last week's episode and I got something wrong--like maybe it being revealed why Sam didn't look for Dean or something or if Amelia was around then I'm sorry if this is off. The goblins got in my TV again last Wednesday and of course fixed it so the CW wouldn't play. I was pissed, too, because I like Charlie (lol, now she... she has chemistry with Dean. whoops. :D). Damnit.

Also, of course, these are all only my thoughts and opinions and are in no way intended to reflect on you or others. And while I am fine with pointing out his many flaws, despite some of my wording, I don't hate Dean. I do think he gets a free pass with far too much shitty behavior and that has been the case with me since 1x1 (oh, yes, I've been a Sam Girl since the Pilot, lol).

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Well, for the most part I agree with you here, except I had the feeling that there was more time between Dean disappearing and Sam hitting the dog than they showed, anyway, that's what I came away with. WE won't get into any of the parts with Dean because I'm too involved with Dean. :) I agree also that what Dean did to Amy was a dick move because he didn't tell Sam. Neither one of them is innocent of being a dick when it comes to their brother, right? I'm not sure if that's why Sam took such a hate on for Benny--he had experience with vampires who controlled their urges before and in fact had influenced Dean into letting Lenore go so I really was taken aback by Sam's reaction.

I think a whole lot of the problems on the show with love (or sex) interests is the actors themselves. Dean is written as a womanizer, it's part or was part, of his character. Clueless about them but ready to jump into bed any time. Problem is, as far as I'm concerned, Jensen has NO chemistry with most of the women on the show. It's really remarkable how little. Sam's written as a borderline monk, and I'm betting that comes from those first two seasons where the contrast between basically greaser vs college kind was meant to be comic relief. The thing is, Jared has CRAZY chemistry with women. Like, scary hot chemistry but Amelia...I felt bad for that actress because they just didn't click onscreen at all so the both of them had an uphill battle.

No, hah, this was a general post just wondering what Samgirls thought of developments. I'm a staunch Deangirl, but my flist skews strongly towards Sam, so I wondered what was going on. 'Course, this is a Sam friendly LJ. Without Sam, there's no Dean. :)

[portraitofafool.livejournal.com]

Yes, yes and yes; especially on the "Jared has chemistry, Jensen doesn't" front. I'm glad it wasn't just me noticing that, to hear it from a Dean Girl is like good news. Lol.

Gah, can I borrow your flist then? It's weird, but most of the SPN people on my flist are hardcore Dean Girls--like the weird and scary kind. I have been defriended over simply not agreeing (mind, I don't mean ranting/pitching a fit/being an asshole) about stuff Dean does/has done. It's really damned bizarre. (Of course I've also been defriended over pointing out that werewolves are not, in fact, fairy creatures. I mean, whut? Whose parade did I piss on there? *scratches head*) Until not too long ago I really didn't think there were as many Sam Girls as there actually seems to be. I thought it was like... me and five other diehard weirdos. Lol.

You're awesome for being open-minded and willing to try and see things from Sam's perspective, I still feel like a lot of people wouldn't do that. Knowing you're Sam Friendly and willing to at least look at both sides makes me feel better; makes me glad to know you, in fact.

You rock, Roxy! :D