SpN 8X09 my off the cuff first reaction

[roxy]

I'm a Dean girl, always have been, even though I don't make a big deal about it. What a douche. I'm going to take a deep breath, do a little woosah. No, fuck that, where does he get *off* with that shit? This is the first time I've ever thought that he made a call that was totally, completely wrong. In seven seasons, he's been a jerk, but let's face it, he's always been right. Not tonight. That was harsh, that was mean, and that was totally self-serving. Trust me, I know very well from self-serving dickery and that was a prime example. He *knew* that was going to hurt. Boy, Dean never forgets and only half-forgives, hunh? How is Sam supposed to come back from that? How are they asking us to *forget* about that? Sam paid all the penance he needs to pay, *all* of it. Anything he did wrong, and don't tell me he wasn't a fucking bitch to Dean with Ruby and the seals and whatnot, he was--but he paid for that. He's got a clean slate. But Dean...*holds up hands* I can't even think right now.

Comments

[sowell.livejournal.com]

I'm with you. Dean, no. Just no.

Frankly, they're both being dicks to each other, and it just makes me dislike them both. Grrr.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

They are, they are, but Dean edged ahead tonight. :(

[tasabian.livejournal.com]

I find Amelia & family so freaking boring I hoped emo Sammy staring through the window was the last we'd see of any of them. Ye gods, that story is a waste. I was really hoping there'd be a twist, that Amelia would be an angel or a siren or something that would give the poor actress something fun to do, but no luck.

And between the two of them, Dean & Sam got poor crazed Martin killed! If Dean hadn't faked the call and Sam hadn't abandon him, Martin wouldn't have had the time to get worked up.

[firesign10.livejournal.com]

Or been there without backup.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

I don't mind the Amelia storyline at all even though I don't think it's going to get anymore interesting than it is now no matter how poor fandom is hoping for more. I didn't like the way they turned Martin into a crazed idiot. I liked sweet, nutty Martin. Sad way to ring the curtain down on that character. :( I think they were trying to say something using him, but what it was was drowned under all the WTF.

[chemm80]

I find Amelia & family so freaking boring I hoped emo Sammy staring through the window was the last we'd see of any of them. Ye gods, that story is a waste. I was really hoping there'd be a twist, that Amelia would be an angel or a siren or something

Oh, this. SO much this.

[firesign10.livejournal.com]

I missed the first half, so am going to watch the whole ep tomorrow. From what I saw in the second half, I am WTF?? Did Dean set Sam up to go see Amelia and Don like that? I hate Amelia, but Sam didn't deserve that at all. I thought we'd seen things get about as bad as they could be between the boys (hello, end of season 4??) but now I think that bar has been reset :-(

[sowell.livejournal.com]

At least at the end of S4 you could feel the love under all the anger and betrayal. Right now they're just being terrible to each other.

[firesign10.livejournal.com]

Yes!! Half the anger and stuff in 4 was them loving each other and just being so pissed and hurt. Here, we aren't getting any of the love anymore, so it's even colder and nastier.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

I feel like the love is still there, it's just getting swamped with all these feelings they have for other people. I feel like we're getting heaps of Dean crazy when it comes to relationships, poor guy.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

That bar really has been reset! Dena might not have purposely set Sam up, but it stunk on ice, what he did.

[runedgirl.livejournal.com]

What Dean did really struck me as the dick move of a jealous boyfriend -- ouch, poor Sammy.

[tifaching.livejournal.com]

See that's how I feel about Sam getting the just released, unstable mental patient to trail Benny. I mean, what was he thinking? Dean tried to tell him it was a mistake, but Dean trusts a vampire. Doesn't he know he should be trusting a man who would hold a woman hostage and cut her neck with a knife to tempt a vampire to feed on her instead?

Not that I'm absolving Dean of that phone call. It was a terrible thing to do. But he did it after Sam left him bleeding and handcuffed to a radiator after said just released unstable mental patient had knocked him unconscious. Which I think was a pretty dick move on Sam's part.

They're both dicks right now and I want them to stop.

[runedgirl.livejournal.com]

They are, but it all has the overly dramatic ring of jealousy to it, which puts an edge on it that's intriguing at the same time as it's infuriating. Neither of them seems to be thinking rationally - they're both lashing out at each other out of hurt and betrayal. And they know how to hurt each other. Actually it rings of good fanfic, but it hurts to see it played out in canon on my screen!

[tifaching.livejournal.com]

Oh, it's definitely jealousy on both their parts. Benny for Sam and Amelia for Dean are like red capes waving in front of bulls. They're going to go off in irrational, whatever I can do to hurt the person I love most who is hurting me ways. I want fanfic of it, but watching it does hurt. I know that a show that's been on for as long as this one has has to evolve, but I want a little less breaking my heart out of the two of them now, please.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Yes! Exactly that! This whole season so far smacks of fanfic, and it's fabulous! I might be ranting and raving at the moment but I'm loving every minute of it,

[chemm80]

It seems like the older the series gets, the more fanficcy it seems. Is that some kind of normal fandom-aging phenomenon? Did that happen with Smallville, for example?

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Oh god, no...not more fanficcy. No, SV was, oh gosh...the first year, and the last two years were the best in my opinion. Lex and Clark loved each other so much in the beginning, and then TPTB realized that this friendship had to go down in flames and preceded to kill it in the most atrocious and badly written ways. I actually never loved the Show the way I love SpN. I loved the Clex and took the show as a necessary evil. Weirdly enough, I started to really enjoy it more when the canon het relationship started to bloom (and I no longer had to suffer that awful, terrible, protracted break-up). Also btw, I *HATED* Jensen on SV. Gag! I was so pissed off that guy from Dark Angel was on my show...though *koff* I entertained a thought or two about Clark and Jason Teague...but now I've gone completely off track, lol!

Anyhoo, no, I think Smallville hated fanfiction and the fans. I don't think back in SV's heyday slash was the wink-wink-nudge-nudge it is today.

[tabaqui]

HELL YES. :)

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

RIGHT??????

It upset me so much! That was cruel! Unless he's really not cluing in that Amelia meant a lot to Sam, which I find hard to believe, because Dean really can read Sam like a book. So sad! Must...not...write...jealousy fic....

[tifaching.livejournal.com]

Must...not...write...jealousy fic.... Why not? Go ahead. Please! I, for one, would love some jealousy fic that might explain some stuff right now.

[smalltrolven.livejournal.com]

It was beyond cruel. Unless Sam hasn't said anything else to Dean about Amelia and so Dean didn't know how much she really meant to him or about Don,etc... Which is entirely possible since they're not communicating.
Please write that jealousy fic, I wanna read it, *grabby hands*, maybe it will make me less sadsadsad.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

oh gosh, I think any story I manage to write would be one long angsty scream.

I'd like to think that Sam hasn't impressed on Dean what Amelia means to him because that would make that phone call less cruel.

[digitalwave]

I had a couple of moments where I yelled at the screen, sweetie. Leaving Dean cuffed to the radiator didn't chuff me much. Sam knows his brother, that, at worst was just a delaying tactic. He knew Dean would get out of those cuffs. But when Sam took off and left martin standing in the middle of the road, and Dean facing whatever I thought, what the hell, Sam? Then, to find out that Dean played Sam like that? That was, at the least, thoughtless and in way too many ways, cruel, on Dean's part. Somebody needs to first kick them both in the butt and then make them sit down and talk to each other.

Kind of neat they've got us all caring about things this much, huh? :)

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

Leaving Dean cuffed to the radiator didn't chuff me much. Sam knows his brother, that, at worst was just a delaying tactic

Oh yeah, that was barely a blip--they do know each other. and Dean obviously has great respect for Sam's abilities, too. Dick move on Sam's part re Martin and well, you know how I felt about my boy doing that to Sam.

Kind of neat they've got us all caring about things this much, huh? :)

Oh my dear, I am *so* invested in this season! I *love* everything they're doing! *GGG*

[tabaqui]

OH MAN.
Just....wow. That was some crazy stuff.
BOYS. They're both just acting so damn *nuts* and jealous and twitchy. They're both *so not right*, and omg! What happened? Did Benny die? Did Dean kill him, or did he let him go? Or....!!!

Poor Martin - what a way to go. And SAM. He's so not over Amelia but i'm still getting such *weird* vibes off their whole deal.... Just wth. Someone else on LJ floated the idea that what if it was Dean watching Sam in the first ep? When he left? And in the fist ep!! Sam left in the dead of night, Amelia asleep in bed, and this time - she wasn't, he was packing and going while she was talking to him....
WHAT IS GOING ON!!!!

I LOVE MY DAMN SHOW. :)

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

I know some folks thought the cliffie was lame but I yelled at my TV set, I mean yelled at the top of my lungs! It's kind of funny how no one responds to me screaming on a Wednesday ha!

I think that was a crap way to end Martin--I mean, he got a good send off but I hate how they destroyed my idea of Martin. But, then again, we only knew Martin from the asylum, and here he seemed like he was about a hot minute from breaking again. Boy, the Winchesters have a *terrible* rep, hunh?

Someone else on LJ floated the idea that what if it was Dean watching Sam in the first ep?

That would be...FASCINATING!
Weird vibe, oh yeah! So much is going on, so many layers and things we don't know and I'm afraid things we might never know but gosh, I hope they settle things out between each other or I'm going to be sad!

[cordelia-gray.livejournal.com]

If it's any consolation, I thought Sam was a way bigger dick this week, and I'm a Sam girl. I don't think I've ever liked either of them less :(

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

omgosh, I can't tell you how *sad* I am that you're not happy with them! I read your posts and I just want to make you tea and cookies and promise you it'll be all right!

I'm a huge Dean girl and I just want to hug poor Sam up. They still love each other. It's just Dean is really hurt at what he sees as Sam's betrayal--which it's not, really, not! Sam snapped hard and thought he found the answer and now he's floundering. I think he actively wanted to overwrite Dean in his head in order to live. Imagine this poor guy and how much misery and loss he's had to deal with, over and over. They've never dealt with anything in a healthy way, and this aspect of their relationship is fascinating to me. The only thing I worry about it there being no fix because I'm not all that sure that Carver really gets the important part of the show *is* the relationship, the friendship.

my stars, I'm really blabby tonight! :)

[cordelia-gray.livejournal.com]

I understood a lot of what Sam was doing, but there were certain things, like getting a person who was obviously unstable and unfit to be hunting involved in that messy family drama, and then stealing his car and ditching him in the woods in the middle of a hunt, which just seem so utterly out of character to me.

As for the love - I want to see it, I just don't right now. Dean taking the time to program Amelia's number into that phone, on the off-chance he'd need to use it someday to manipulate Sam - not seeing a lot of love or trust there. I feel like the relationship has passed through "unhealthy" and into "toxic" at this point.

[portraitofafool.livejournal.com]

I didn't get to see past the first 15 minutes--television goblins struck again, I threw a mini-tantrum and then watched The Avengers. HOWEVER. What I am reading--and even the smackerel I did see--has me gnashing my teeth. I won't go into my feelings since, like you, I try to keep things Not a Big Deal (I don't get the warring stuff, never have; makes my head hurt).

That... This that happened tonight though... *snarls* I have thoughts, yes indeed, I do. I am just. I. I've said something like this was going to happen since... a while back. And damnit, it is. :(

If--and that is a big if--the show would go that direction, what we have here are fine ingredients for an all-out Winchester-on-Winchester war. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't end well for anyone caught in the crossfire--or for the boys either. Even if they survived one another, the damage would be huge and I don't think they'd ever recover from it.

There's still something so intrinsically them with this stuff that's been there since day one: They don't think about it, but they take down everyone around them in betwixt all of the other stuff; whether it be for love, anger or jealousy. In that respect, both Sam and Dean hurt (and have hurt) a lot of good people all because of their "crazy, tangled up thing" (think I got that right). That includes each other and themselves. It's sad and it's epic... and totally dysfunctional. Can we say, "unhealthy relationship"? I try to take a step back and look at the Big Picture (it feels like a title in my mind) and that's part of what I see when I do so. It's fascinating in many ways, but it's also awful in many other ways.

At this rate, I really don't see anything at all like a happy ending unless several episodes were actively devoted to them making peace with one another. Anything less than that and any kind of happy ending they tried to give us to this season would feel contrived. I'll take a tragedy over something like that. I'm sitting back with my helmet on, waiting to see where this goes because I am hooked, too, no doubt.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

They don't think about it, but they take down everyone around them in betwixt all of the other stuff; whether it be for love, anger or jealousy. In that respect, both Sam and Dean hurt (and have hurt) a lot of good people all because of their "crazy, tangled up thing" (think I got that right). That includes each other and themselves.

It's *so* screwed up. I thought that with Lisa, and it would have happened with any relationship Dean ever had, and it's going to always be an issue with Sam. I can see Sam doing his best to show Dean he can have a relationship with a person and do it better than Dean never could and meanwhile make himself and some poor woman miserable.

I pray that for *once*, they actually make their relationship better or at least put them in a place where they can actually head that way.

[gingersnap1224.livejournal.com]

Here's something that struck me tonight. I thought Sam left Amelia and went to meet Dean, but no one actually said that's what he did. It would be too much of a coincidence if Don came back the exact same time as Dean. So Sam must have left before Dean got back. What happened to Sam in the time between leaving Amelia and going to Dean?

I do agree that the fake message was a supremely dick move. Dean has been a lot of things over the years, but cruel isn't one of them. I'm sure he doesn't know the extent of Sam and Amelia's relationship because Sam doesn't seem like he's in a sharing mood with Dean and Dean hasn't seen the soft focus fashback-a-rama, but that was still really mean.

I also think it was very unlike Sam to leave an unstable guy in the path of a vampire.

What is going on??? It's like bizarro SPN. But I love it.

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

. I'm sure he doesn't know the extent of Sam and Amelia's relationship because Sam doesn't seem like he's in a sharing mood with Dean and Dean hasn't seen the soft focus fashback-a-rama, but that was still really mean.

Now that I've chilled a bit, I have to agree with you. There's no reason to assume that Dean knew how Sam truly felt about Amelia--he's probably comparing Sam's relationship to Lisa and his. Because sorry, there's no way in the world anyone can convince me that he thought that was a lifetime love, not when he chose Sam over her.

[laurapetri.livejournal.com]

The text was a dickish move on Dean's part but not really cause as he admits he never checked on her so Dean has no idea about Don etc. And I admit being a Dean girl makes me really less tolerant of Sam's attitude and the flash backs bore me. Sam has just been waiting to prove Dean wrong about Benny. This is bit of pet peeve I have with the show. Sam always trying to act like he's better or knows better thanDean and he seldom is and it just ends up into a bigger clusterfuck. Okay rant over back to normal programming

[roxymissrose.livejournal.com]

My original thought was that it was a dick move because he had to have had some idea of how much Amelia meant to Sam--but maybe not, at second thought. Still, that was crappy and I'm still steamed with Dean. As for me, for a Dean girl, I tend to be supportive of Sam. Sure, he acts like an asshole and never listens to Dean when he should but that just makes him the little brother. I think he *acts* like he knows more than Dean because Dean makes him feel inadequate, even though Dean doesn't set out to create that feeling and he certainly doesn't feel that Sam comes up short.

Ah, SpN, you're raking fandom over the coals!